Committee for Skeptical Inquiry

[Barry Karr <SkeptInq@AOL.COM>]

CSICOP on CNN

This week on CNN's "Anderson Cooper 360"
(http://www.cnn.com/CNN/Programs/anderson.cooper.360/index.html), there was
a weeklong series of segments on miracles. Monday featured the case of
Audrey Santo. Tuesday was devoted to the Roman Catholic Church's "Miracle
Verification Unit." On Wednesday, CNN Medical Correspondent Sanjay Gupta
discussed alleged medical miracles. Thursday was devoted to visions and
simulacra of the Virgin Mary, and the final segment tonight will discuss why
people believe in miracles.

To the credit of Anderson Cooper and the producers and researchers of "360,"
they relied on CSICOP, and, in particular our Senior Research Fellow Joe
Nickell--who was on "360" this past June to discuss the Milton Madonna
case--to add the skeptical perspective on these topics.

Nickell appeared on the Monday night segment to discuss Audrey Santo. His
pre-taped appearance was short, but on Tuesday, CNN asked him to come back
for a live appearance for the Thursday segment on visions of Mary. Here's an
excerpt from the transcript (available at
http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0312/18/acd.00.html):

COOPER: Many different sightings. Over the last couple of nights, we've
heard from a couple of people who say they were miraculously cured of
disease. It wouldn't be a balanced series on miracles without the
perspective of a skeptic, a professional debunker.

Joe Nickell has spent considerable time looking for logical explanations to
the seemingly miraculous for the magazine "Skeptical Inquirer," and many
books, including "Looking for a Miracle." He joins us in Buffalo, New York,
tonight.

Thanks very much for being with us, Joe. You have investigated a lot of
these apparitions. Have you ever found one that you simply could not
explain?

JOE NICKELL, "SKEPTICAL INQUIRER": Not really. When I've had a fair chance
to examine them, a lot of these sightings that are internal, where some
visionary sees the Virgin Mary and no one else does, those are usually due
to what's called a fantasy-prone personality. And we've done pretty
extensive studying of them.

"In Campbell, Ohio, you mentioned the case of the glowing statues. I was
down there and did extensive research. And there's just no question that it
was a gold leaf on the statues that was simply shining from ambient light.
And that's all it was. It was no miracle at all.

COOPER: Well why...

NICKELL: And, yes, I'm sure of that.

COOPER: Well why the large number of sightings, in particular of the Virgin
Mary, you think?

COOPER: Well, I think that Mary has a special place in Roman Catholicism,
which is the source of most of these apparitions. It brings the feminine
perspective to the Catholic Church, which in other ways, the hierarchy is
all male. So I think there's a popular movement to bring the female side
out, and so Catholics venerate the Virgin Mary.

COOPER: It's interesting, though, as I'm sure you know. People come up with
different explanations for why an apparition will appear. I think it was
this past sumner in Milton, Massachusetts. I think that was the one the
window of a hospital.

I mean, the people that cleaned the hospital had a particular explanation of
condensation in the window. But those who came and were looking at some of
the pictures of them, they all came up with different explanations of why
the Virgin Mary was appearing then and there.

NICKELL: Yes, they did. They were trying to equate it with some kind of
activity, whether it was abortion or some of the troubles in the Church.

But, in fact, I was at Milton and talked with hospital authorities, and that
image, in some form, had been there for about five years. Just all of a
sudden, maybe, as it grew in shape -- it's just a stain between the two
windows, the seal leaked and allowed the sealant to -- residue to come in
and create a random stain. That's all these images are, are random stains.

COOPER: You know, Joe -- and I'm sure we're going to get a lot of e-mails on
this, very critical of you -- there are some people who say, look, people
see maybe what they want to see, and what's so wrong with believing in an
apparition like this? Why try to debunk it?

NICKELL: Well, if they criticize me in emails, they'll have to criticize
most of the Roman Catholic Church which has not authenticated most of these
random stains. And in fact, church spokesmen at Milton that I appeared on
BBC with, actually told me they discounted that as a miracle. I just try not
to be any less skeptical than the priests.

COOPER: Fair enough. Joe Nickell, appreciate you coming in and talking with
us. Fascinating perspective, thank you Joe."

---

In addition to his appearances on 360, Joe Nickell contributed his expertise
to some of the other segments this week. Transcripts of all of this week's
miracles segments on "Anderson Cooper 360" are available at
http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/acd.html.

There are several Skeptical Inquirer articles by Joe Nickell and others on
the topics covered this week on CNN, visit the CSICOP Web site at
http://www.csicop.org.


- Kevin Christopher, Public Relations Director, CSICOP
(mailto:press@csicop.org)


and speaking of CNN

Below is the Award that CSICOP has bestowed upon none other than Larry King.





to see why we feel Larry is so deserving of this award please visit:

CSICOP online:
http://www.csicop.org/doubtandabout/larryking/

Time magazine online:
http://www.time.com/time/columnist/jaroff/article/0,9565,538305,00.html